Re: thought I'd put in my 2 cents

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: Chris i never called you any names. And if you take a look at all of my posts you will see that I dont call names. : I said that your comment was insensitive because you called gays sickos, which is insensitive. I am sorry if i seemed rude, I had been up all night and was very agrivated so I apologize. : : : Good post, Chris. Maybe our friend X will learn a little about what it means to have a friendly, polite debate without name-calling. : : I would generally agree that FOTF probably has a lot to learn. They seem snobby to me: the kind of people that think they know everything and have all the answers. But from what I can tell, they have a rather conservative, mainstream American approach to family life and society. For the most part, they use select examples that support their view (who doesn't?), and often have a rather tunnelled view on life. They don't back down from their unpopular opinions, which makes them an inevitable target -- but none of their actual teachings about how to raise a family are outside of what most conservative Christians believe. : : Three further points I want to make. First, whether or not FOTF is misguided has nothing to do with the merits of what they teach. An example: Hitler was a vegetarian, but that doesn't mean vegetarianism is bad. In other words, evaluate FOTF's methods and arguments on their merits, rather than on the fact they come from FOTF. Even psychotics are make sense sometimes. : : 2nd point: I would be very interested to hear what exactly qualifies the books and papers you mention as "very biased, unfair and disgusting doctoral work that FOTF uses as refrence points to thier position on homosexuality as a whole." I am curious: this particular message board is almost obsessed with scientific studies, what makes these ones automatically bad and the others automatically good? : : 3rd point is regarding this letter you attached. It sounds very much to me like the parents of this poor kid tried to implement Dobson's ideas, but went wildly overboard. It sounds like he was beaten up! He even acknowledges that POWs wouldn't be allowed to be treated that way. My view is that his parents ought to be locked up, not Dobson. Dobson is in favour of a smack or two now and again (tons of parents agree with him), but never on the level of a beating, so it's hard to believe his parents did this "by the book". It's truly tough to say why this fellow is such a mess, but sometimes the patients themselves don't even know. So we need to take these matters with a grain of salt. : : any regards, : : Chris : : : Next my original post was just an introduction and pointing out of what I see as a regular, disturbing pattern. If you were to take the () out of the entire article, it would read absolutely fine. : : : It was stating my interpretation and I was seeking input to see if others agreeed with me or not on the topic of FOTF's way of doing things. Just to see if others held the same view. So no, there really was no argument to begin with. : : : Secondly I have a stack of books and papers direct from FOTF of very biased, unfair and disgusting doctoral work that FOTF uses as refrence points to thier position on homosexuality as a whole. This issue, sadly, is not the only issue they use with such tactics. : : : Here is a letter I grabbed off of the site that X refered to in his earler responces. I believe this letter coincides that Dobson's tapes on child rearing are very destructive. I believe this testimony coincides with the 13 year old's distress after he heard the tapes too, which would make a correlation. : : : http://elroy.net/ehr/antifocus.html#hurt : : : -------------------------------------------- : : : Dear Mr. Mckinley, : : : Subject: What? I'm not alone? : : : First an introduction: : : : My name is _________. I live in Canada, in Ontario, in a small town called _________. I am 21 years old and slowly building a career in politics as a social democrat. : : : I was raised as a child by the Dobson's methods. I went to a Christian School whose idea of sexual education was to put on a Dobson tape and tell us to take notes. I was given "tough love" because my parents were confused with certain aspects of my personality that Dobson claimed was "passive rebellion". Ergo, I was given "spankings" (the details of which I will spare you, but I understand that not even Prisioners of War, according to the Geneva Covention, should be treated in such ways). It was all done by the book (Dobson's books) and his radio shows were always on the radio. : : : Three nervous breakdowns, years of therapy and support groups, and a lost childhood later, I am just starting to learn what Mr. Dobson's theories have done to me. Despite this, millions continue to listen and adhere to his destructive approach to parenting. : : : For years, I thought I was alone in this opinion. : : : My parents and I have made our peace over the past. But, it churns my stomach to know he carries on. : : : ------------------------------------------------- : : : I'm just wondering if anyone out there shares my view that FOTF and other religous/political orginizations are manipulative and deceptive in their ministry. : : : God bless, : : : ~Chris G.

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